LSS, the "free market" (which doesn't really exist) isn't designed to change fast enough for a volatile industry like the airlines. But.can't raise interest. As for the FA's..they will definitely be lined up around the block for a job like this with those benies. He couldn't pay me $1200 to fly them for a month. I think it will succeed as long as they can attract enough flight attendants on an ongoing basis. However, earning minimum wages at a dead-end job, working every weekend, no benefits, no time/money/opportunity to explore new cities, and being forced to sign a 4-year contract at the outset are all red flags that employment as a flight attendant at Breeze should be avoided at all costs. Would you pay your doctor, lawyer, nurse, even architect, engineer, electrician, plumber, welder etc. No thank you! 1) Against unions: not every employee is good at negotiating. Yes, they are using and abusing us. That minimum guarantee is just that, a minimum. Or the app crashing? We pay the least to all our staff! Or what if you Wow, quite a few idiot comments: This airline is banking on their 4 year contract holding up. A huge percentage of new flight attendants leave within the first year. Bottom line: Supply and Demand principles are at play. 5) I will meet many travelers and may be able to network my way into other opportunities when I As a college student, I love the idea! This has been the business model of little outfits like this for 30 years. Of course, what's needed is a severe pilot shortage to really change up the whole industry. These comments are something else. Will they get pilots? First year SkyWest pilots make more than Breeze pilots. Their value is astronomical. That 20-hour difference each month makes a huge difference in annual salary, regardless of the hourly rate offered. @rich Does your fast food place include housing as part of compensation? You should be too. I think the best way for this airline to implement their business model is to pay for its pilots training from 0 hrs to 1500 hrs and then these pilots can work for them at their pay scale that will make more sense. Please view our advertising policy page for additional details about our partners. Finally, Breeze needs to get its financial footing or their employees could all be forced out on the street. With Avelo Airlines having launched operations yesterday, Breeze Airways is expected to be the next US airline startup to begin flying. Almost every airline has it in the agreement that upon graduation from FA training you have to get yourself to whatever base they need crew at. Im sure theyd leap at the chance to earn USD given the depreciation of the R$. Stay connected with the latest travel, aviation, and credit card news. To that end, it's not that much different than regular college life (many students work part time), but you won't burden yourself with huge college debt because those kids won't have to worry about tuition and housing. The wont to have pilots on there books, but wont have at the beginnig a lot of flightsSo from a business point it makes sence to have more pilots who only fligh 55h instead of having less pilots with 75h. That rate of pay is so low and that availability schedule requires so much flexibility that I have to imagine he isn't targeting primarily college students, who have class schedules to contend with, but high school graduates and GED holders up through their early 20s. Interesting. This number represents the median, which is the midpoint of the ranges from our proprietary Total Pay Estimate model and based on salaries collected from our users. And many of the commenters on here will fill seats when UA is 5x the price on the same route regardless of what they think of labor rights or real college education. Pilots from Compass and Expressjet will flock to Breeze to maintain currency. Right now I believe there are more pilots than are needed. The Breeze pilots, once hired, will see the Neeleman is begging for a pilot union to quickly form on his new airline, whether he knows it or not. Barracks or proper housing and will the company take it out of their paycheque? If its actually cheaper and leg room isnt a total disaster, their planes will be full. Where do I sign up? If a pilot gets into a successful start up, the long term benefit to quality of life could be substantial and shouldn't be dismissed out of hand. They can't practice on their own. I think Breeze will likely be cheaper while SW offers 2 free checked bags. hide. The job may fit more workers than you think. Housing and travel to/from work provided. Breeze has promised to pay flight attendants a fixed monthly rate of $1,200, alongside an annual bursary of $6,000 and free shared company accommodation. 28 years represented by ALPA, walked the picket line 29 days in 1985 and was ready to do it again several times during my career to entice management to come to the negotiating table with a better contract for pilots. Unfortunatetly, US travel and passenger fare remains an uncertainty. Eight hours plus. Does the fact that all FA positions are, looking at the website, classified as "part-time" allow them to avoid paying for health insurance? They make expensive mistakes. At the end of the day your skill set is only worth what the market will pay. I think these "internships" are not meant for people looking at a career as a flight attendant, but rather college age kids looking for a unique experience. Most people care about price and reasonably courtesy interactions. Not exclusively, but the idea of a University education is as much participating in a community of students as it is sitting in classrooms. They have no employees right now and are relying upon applicants to look at the pay and say "Sounds good enough to me." They both seem to have similar business models, but SW has really gotten expensive in some markets these past few years. I'm much more concerned about the pilot pay scale than whatever arrangement Breeze works out with its FAs. They are not hired to be sex symbols and keep men sexually entertained through out the flight; therefore, I could care less how old you are as long as you can save my life in the event of an emergency. I'm glad to see you're excited to join the industry. Lets compare Breezes pilot pay to that of a couple of other airlines: Heres JetBlues Embraer 190 pilot pay scale: JetBlue Embraer 190 pilots get paid way more. Before we get into the details of Breezes pilot pay, and compare it to pay at other airlines, note that: First year Breeze pilots will make $36,300. Employees pay for their school and housing, but Breeze gets the tax savings. Almost every airline has it in the @Samuel - Housing is a big plus and at Breeze it is included. Why are we encouraging a race to the bottom? Breeze Airways PAYSCALES CAPTAIN PAY SCALE (Hourly) FIRST OFFICER PAY SCALE (Hourly) PAY CALCULATOR (Click and drag the sliders) Pay Rate: $150 Credit Time: 75 Hours Bid Periods: 1 Percentage: 1 $11,250 PAY NOTES Monthly Pay Guarantee for Line Holders: 70 hours Monthly Pay Guarantee for Reserves: 70 hours PER DIEM Scheduled pay raises: Yearly Not if you wanted good work done. MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands It will be interesting to see how this twist in offering a perpetual/consistently youthful corps of flight attendants at Breeze versus those with (decades of) seniority at other airlines plays out, thats for sure. Breeze Airways insights Based on 31 survey responses Areas for improvement Fair pay for job Support from manager Overall satisfaction Bad leadership Customer Service Representative (Former Employee) - Salt Lake City, UT - February 13, 2023 Breeze has potential as a start-up. anything less than market rate? A job that solves the problem of housing takes an enormous number of costs away from young people, and the "$1200 salary" needs to be evaluated in that context. Posted by 5 minutes ago. All rights reserved. I'm curious how many days on-call per month they have. This is absolutely exploitive. The systems are good at remembering my preferences though. This arrogant capitalist needs to be forced to live in poverty too. The pay scale also looks good. Most professionals are comfortable with the idea of a starter job, and aren't looking for a father figure in their employer to guide them gently into old age. You and your self-interested cronies don't get to decide what type of jobs people choose to take. Someone has the verb and the noun meanings of intern confused. When I spoke to Utah Valley Univ recruiters they hinted heavily the program was designed for the under 25 crowd. Sad that people in society know what's best for everybody else and don't want people making their own decisions. Corporate apartments with two bedrooms. Get real. Many young girls and guys want to be a flight attendant from 20-65 or older. ), what most likely happened after you got your paralytic and your anesthesia is some slightly tired, fresh-face resident came in to practice his/her craft on you. Technology is greatuntil something goes wrong. I suppose if there has ever been a time where airlines can get away with hiring pilots for cheap, this is it. The airline is expected to start selling tickets any day now, and I know many of us are curious about what the Salt Lake City-based carriers first routes will be. Even with the limited details we know, its clear Breeze will be different than other airlines, from its approach to hiring flight attendants, to its cost structure, to its fleet. Let's seean airline you interact with almost completely on an app staffed by young folks with no vested interest in the company or it's success.what could possibly go wrong? Would you like to buy a filet mignon sandwich that we can hand deliver to you in your seat? Just add all these fun little add-ons where you can just click yes, yes, yes. And we can just keep dinging the credit card.. Read on. I think the FAA needs to look into this. Many young girls and guys want to be a flight attendant from 20-65 or older. Attn: Airline Pilot Central The airline is hiring both pilots and flight attendants, given that its close to launching operations. Sounds ripe for an age discrimination lawsuit at some point too. El Segundo, CA 90245. There is no contract (at will employment) and health insurance is provided and optional. No guests. Im glad to see youre excited to join the industry. JetBlue pilots earn significantly more per hour and are given a 70-hour monthly guarantee. Just be transparent. I'm sure Breeze will find plenty of young, naive college students who sign up for this, not realizing what they are getting themselves into. Flew my 4day trip and took a Delta flight departing at 12:25am to MSP and connected to MDW. After the carrier recently announced the hourly pay offered to pilots, however, the aforementioned description may not be satisfactory. If its actually cheaper and leg room isnt a total disaster, their planes will be full. Interesting. Our point-to-point network means no connections for an easier, quicker and nicer journey. There have been several regionals that have gone under recently which have temporarily flooded the market with pilots. Since most flight attendants are women - it also shows how Neeleman views females. I think the deal is too good to be true while others think it's chump change and will never work. And Coke Zero, make it a large. And if I had a time machine I would go back and slap, poor, poor me silly and tell me to redirect my attention to the unlimited opportunities that were sitting right in front of me every day I drove across the lake and clocked into work. First Officer 1st year $89 and $130 in year six. Please view our advertising policy page for additional details about our partners. The offered wages are above-average ates in the United States. If you fly anywhere close to a normal schedule, the numbers look brighter. There's a lot Obviously, a lot of people are not aware of what a flight attendant's role is (listen up Neeleman). To compare, many carriers guarantee at least 75 hours a month. These days she brings home a little bit more than that: she earned it. 3.Enough may feel that this is just fine for 1-2 years. We don't really know enough at this point. It can be very exciting and rewarding, but. At 5 bucks an hour. Guest Service Plan. 'Fly Breeze for peanuts' could be a marketing slogan aimed at pilots as well as passengers. Obviously, a lot of people are not aware of what a flight attendant's role is (listen up Neeleman). Contract of Carriage. Spirit flight attendants are generally better than AA and UA. This seems more in line with what they should be receiving for compensation. Your feedback is important in helping us keep our community safe. That rate of pay is so low and that availability schedule requires so much flexibility that I have to imagine he isn't targeting primarily college students, who have class schedules to contend with, but high school graduates and GED holders up through their early 20s. Breeze will be a low cost carrier primarily operating point-to-point routes that arent currently served. There will be scheduled 1% pay raises on September 15, 2023, and September 15, 2024. Sounds awfully low especially with a 55-hour minimum pay. Nobody knows yet. Therefor your flight attendant is going to be exhausted/probably not happy and definitely not rested enough to perform optimally in an emergency. /s. 1. I worked as a host at a restaurant for minimum wage in college and didnt make close to $1200/mo and still had full tuition and room/board to pay. It can be very exciting and rewarding, but. the recruiters told me: *No insurance provided. That's the Breeze way. 1) Free Housing! I don't see a huge ad component to revenue, which isn't how he ran JetBlue when he started it in the lowest point of the dotcom bust era. Individuals can't afford premiums. Free shipping for many products! Your feedback is important in helping us keep our community safe. Checking in Online. This same thing happened in Brazil with Azul. According to Neeleman: Ive shared my general thoughts on Breeze in the past, though based on these updates I have a few more things to add: Breeze should be launching operations shortly, becoming the second new US airline to launch in a matter of weeks. Its all about price. Its schedule, price, loyalty program. Take it easy. In the meantime, if you don't like the pay, go see if another airline is hiring. No Per Diem. 2. And many of the commenters on here will fill seats when UA is 5x the price on Are all the posts from FAs at other airlines? I would have loved an opportunity like this. I suspect the *average* monthly paid hours across the whole year will be a lot higher. Breeze Airways provides nonstop service between underserved routes across the U.S. at affordable fares. I dwelled on my sad fate at length. While we do try to list all the best miles and points deals, the site does not include all card companies or credit card offers available in the marketplace. I am sure they expect this, but will like to see what happens. What they do at launch and what they do 2 years later can be entirely different. @RobertB unless Breeze starts showing a pattern of denying jobs to older, experienced flight attendants who want to do the work and following Breeze's presumably legal employment practices, there is no discrimination. Thanks for being transparent that these comments are nearly all from a union organizing push before the airline even launches. its entrepreneurs and change-makers. Should be a wage and hour attorney's dream; they'll be subject to every state's wage/hour laws wherever they fly and be subject to both private lawsuits as well as administrative cases from the wage/hour agency in those respective states. I will be marching tomorrow on May Day for an egalitarian communist revolution with hundreds of myvworking class comrades in Brooklyn. *Layovers will be rare (mechanical issues, weather), trip planning will be turns out and back same day. (Example: last day of training in Chicago they say you're assigned to Newark. And I agree with the fellow poster RE: all very young kids, limited work experience not what Id want in an emergency. The industry does need an overall. Clearly Breeze has already figured out that people who fall into their trap will regret their circumstances; that's why Breeze is also making them sign a 4-year contract. D. Delta Echo Well-Known Member. Unfortunately flying is something easy to be passionate about, and the industry takes advantage. Only Skyworst has no union in the regional game, and they continue to get guys to sign up by force feeding the kool-aid by the tankful. If not the airplane no flight. Breeze Will Pay Flight Attendants $1,200 Per Month, Wants To Ding Your Credit Card, Avelo Airlines having launched operations, Breeze Airways is expected to be the next US airline startup, expected to start selling tickets any day now, Breeze Airways views flight attendants as interns, Breeze wants you to buy a filet mignon sandwich, Breeze will have low fares, no change fees, Breeze has a huge cost advantage over competitors, Breezes controversial approach to hiring flight attendants, Should Babies Be Allowed In First Class? Anyone have any info on what flying for Breeze Airways is like? The airline should do fine, at least up to a certain scale. *Layovers will be rare (mechanical issues, weather), trip planning will be "turns" - out and back same day. Maybe its just SPS. 8 hours reserve gets 4 hours of pay $38 per hour. El Segundo, CA 90245, Do Not Sell or Share My Personal Information, Meet the Breeze team at upcoming events! What sets Breeze Airways hourly salaries apart is the monthly hourly guarantee, which is only 55 hours, or at most, $7,865 per month before taxes (for Captains in their sixth year). P Glotzer (United States) 1st March 2023. This is a very exciting idea indeed! Is Breeze Airways pilot pay unreasonable? return on investment. High Flex. The benefit of getting on right now at Breeze is seniority in the future. Lots of opinion injected here but believe me they do not have a shortage of applications. It's that, or these guys and their families starve. You seem to be an angry young man. Then there are the wages and hours questions. Breeze Airways First Officers: $62,000 by year six, JetBlue First Officers: $117,000 by year six, Breeze Airways Captains: $94,000 by year six. @Ben L. exhibiting developmental delay for snark: that's concerning. How much do Breeze Airways employees make? Alaska Airlines Business Card Review: 70K Miles & Lufthansas Boeing 787 Business Class: Exactly As Expected. Our model gets smarter over time as more people share salaries on Glassdoor. Are they also going to have INTERN PILOTS to fuel this business plan? At least, I can't find that information. Also: are families welcome? Never found out what would happen if you fall below 3.0. It will be interesting to see how it plays out for sure. What does the department of labor think about this? The corporate-provided housing actually sounds like an appealing thing for many college students. Every Friday Saturday, and Sunday of the month. Scary and for sure a company that will NEVER see me on any of there planes! However, in reality thats not hugely different than the schedules that flight attendants work at other airlines full time. These numbers are minimums. less than daily to leisure/small markets. The role of flight attendant will be more like an internship than a career, because Neeleman believes flight attendants dont improve much with years of experience, and that they can get trapped in a dead-end job due to the seniority system we see at other airlines: Its not something politically correct but its something David wholeheartedly believes in, says Trey Urbahn, a Breeze board member whos worked with Neeleman at several of his other airlines. I think they are going to offer a lot of things people actually might want to pay for, deliver them speedily and in a high quality way, and make it attractive to buy multiple products. The most important sentence in this article is this the only reason to become a pilot at Breeze is if you have no other options. Even if/though they get corporate housing (which could also be really dismal) they've still got to pay for food. In the past, he has always favored taking care of his employees. ", but I actually challenge you to schedule surgery with a doctor with only a GED. 2) housing: I am curious what housing? Learn about Breeze Airways culture, salaries, benefits, work-life balance, management, job security, and more. And was told that 90% would be "turns", out and back same day - no layovers. Cringing at the pay rateless than $100 per day and the hours can be brutal. The estimated salary at Breeze Airways ranges from approximately $14,500 per year for Team Leader to $150,907 per year for Director.. What do you make of these Breeze insights? There are a finite quantity of qualified pilots and the barrier to entry for that work is significant. As a college student, I love the idea! I wish you luck in you career and travels. 2. Not how youd describe most 70-year-olds. 28 years represented by ALPA, walked the picket line 29 days in 1985 and was ready to do it again several times during my career to entice management to come to the negotiating table with a better contract for pilots. It's capitalism in it's most raw form. Impressive to see how discussion of new airline business immediately decedents into anti-religious bigotry. Don't forget that for a person to be a doctor capable for surgery they need to have completed medical school, but for someone to be a flight attendant they only need a GED. The low cost price they originally show you is a scam. Chances if you have surgery, you already have. Glad I was just in time to work and fly through the good times and happily retired now. Rude, Fat-Fugly, Nasty, Filthy, Unfit. The starting and long-term salaries offered by Breeze Airway are as follows for First Officers and Captains: First Officers: $55 an hour raise to $94 an hour by the sixth year of employment, Captains: $117 an hour raised to $143 an hour by year six of flying with the company. A great position to have in your 20's while you work towards advancing your education or other opportunities. They understand that our pursuit of Excellence is not a destination, but rather, a journey. Its unfair pay but it is a fun job and these are weird times. Could happen. They are not hired to be sex symbols and keep men sexually entertained through out the flight; therefore, I could care less how old you are as long as you can save my life in the event of an emergency. They can't practice on their Great idea. This was the skybus business plan. Posts: 36,185. Some can force their way, others will accept any offer out of fear to lose their job. Actual flight time? Salary to both of these groups of people is somewhat incidental. Having been a flight attendant I can tell you 15 days is not part time. Then, when mainline hiring picks-up (as it inevitably will) they'll dump Breeze like a cheap date. I will make $15-20 per hour for my hard work on average when you figure all the work we do for free. Are all the posts from FAs at other airlines? The company may credit new hires for any prior active years of service at another Part 121/135 air carrier or at a Mesa-affiliated pilot development program for purposes of calculating years of service for compensation, vacation, and retirement. We wont pay for nice things. At the end of last month, the Association of Flight Attendants-CWA - AFA United Master Executive Council analyzed Breeze's program. @Samuel - Housing is a big plus and at Breeze it is included. But make sure you ask the a million question, even the stupid ones BEFORE you sign the contract. I already feel bad for the disadvantaged kids that will end up getting wrangled into this to help pay for a couple semesters of college. Its stated that the role of flight attendants will be part time, as theyll work 15 days per month. Breeze Airways will initially fly Embraer 190s, but eventually plans to operate a fleet consisting exclusively of Airbus A220s. . The initiative will see flight attendants be paid a fixed sum of $1,200 each month. You can work at a lot of fast food places and now get $15 an hour plus benefits. The average pilot will make more than this. pilots from the majors who took retirement might jump at the chance to fly again. So theyre going to get experienced pilots (somewhat), that are already typed, with 1K hrs of 121 time (most likely), not have to pay initial or differences training for them, then pay them sh. Seems like they could be taking advantage of this particular moment in time, and the situation the industry is in. Our business address is: Frankly Im somewhere in the middle here. Once the market rebounds they will have to adjust the MMG to remain competitive. This is a prime example of how capitalism is at the cancer stage in the United States, and rapidly approaching stage 4. Expect PGD, IAG, SFB, ORH, RFD, PIT and to change seasonally. I have suggested reestablishing a mandatory retirement age for flight crew and a renaming to inflight first responders. Overall, it sounds like he spent his time in Brazil calculating every aspect of his U.S. comeback. Unions. Ben -- one thing that seems to be missing from your calculus and the comments: equity. Great article !!! $1,200/mo if you have 15 days off and $1,400/mo if only 10. American would attempt to get the lowest pay rates in the industry on comparable equipment. Many may look back later in life with a better career and better economics fondly with the experience they had along with friendships made. So they only want young, pretty, college girls and completely straight acting College guys? Low fares. "Filet mignon sandwich?" As a pilot with one of the aforementioned regionals, this is an ongoing conversation. 2. $1,200 a month is an embarrassment. Because expanding the monthly rate to 75+ is done so much easier and instant, than hirring another 200 pilots or so. Whatta country! Love it! New. What Are Redeye Flights? Dolts.read the whole article. CORRECTION for the above; should be as follows: - like airlines based in countries that still allow for hiring and firing based on age., Apologies for the error! Position: Engines Turn Or People Swim. Ahead of the launch, Forbes has an interesting story about the airline, after having spent some time with founder David Neeleman. Captain will make 3 times this Im surprised David Neeleman would set such low rates for pay. A union can negotiate for the whole group, unity makes force. There is not a lot to do these days in an aircraft cabin. This is corporate serfdom masquerading as an "opportunity". That sounds part time and probably better since you are getting paid for all of your time. Can't believe. 10 years have passed, the salary for new FO's are basically the same but now you need at least 10 year as FO to become a captain. It's silly to ape outrage when we don't know a lot of the details of the actual work and schedule. I felt fortunate. Pilots are incredibly overpaid as it is. Also: are families welcome? The pay scale offered is not "borderline exploitative", it IS exploitative. Not exclusively, but the idea of a University education is as much participating in a community of students as it is sitting in classrooms. I wonder if its plausible he could bring some pilots up from Azul to fill gaps if US pilots arent too interested? For a certain person, this could be an ideal job. 3) Solid work experience in my chosen industry! Never found out what would happen if you fall below 3.0. Breeze Airways Wants To Pay Pilots How Much?! . I do not believe for a minute service will be worse than economy on AA or UA. There will be plenty of applicants! Of course we know what Nelson is really up: unions cant stand having to compete and this model could threaten her power and the power of her union. . This is absolutely exploitive. A hundred years ago, Kendor would be talking about the joys of working one's way up from being a frontline Pinkerton goon to the guy commanding a whole squad of goons. Airfare provided to go home monthly. Breeze vs. JetBlue pilot pay Here's JetBlue's Embraer 190 pilot pay scale: First officers are paid $89 per hour in year one, and $130 per hour in year six Captains are paid $192 per hour in year one, and $203 per hour in year six Pilots are guaranteed pay for 75 hours per month of flying In other words: I worked my way through college and I would have LOVED to have free housing provided. At Breeze, we want to empower and support our Team Members so they can, in turn, empower and support our Guests every step of the journey. Do you really want to get on an airplane flown by people with financial problems and no better options? Would you pay your doctor, lawyer, nurse, even architect, engineer, electrician, plumber, welder etc. You get paid to sign up more people to pay union dues. Many of those interns go on to be millionaires, build businesses, and manage to be +5 insightful and funny. Good luck, Febreeze! Very interesting article, first off there's a lot of people who only want to work part-time and find it exciting to go to different cities. We are in search of the best and the brightest to join our dynamic team of aviation and people enthusiasts. It's not like America's legacy airlines are immune to hiring very young, very inexperienced people. The downside for me, and they exist in almost all arrangements, is the unknown as to whether we'll have health insurance.
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